My Hot Leads
These guys are just the notorious "American Blast Fax" (aka Sunbelt Marketing) group re-incarnated with a different name. The send faxes to every state except the 2 states that have injunctions against them.
We get more complaints about My Hot Leads than any other junk faxer.
There have been two TV news stories on My Hot Leads:
- TV news story and video on My Hot Leads from WFAA-TV in Texas September 19, 2007
- Former Junk Fax Worker Talks about My Hot Leads from ABC affiliate in Tampa, FL Oct 8, 2007
If you want to get off their list, fax your fax number to 972-407-1808. If that doesn't work, call 877-886-4808 x104 (now disconnected) which is David Vaughn's extension and keep leaving him voicemails until they remove your number. If that doesn't work, contact us and we'll publish more numbers you can use. I also have a partial list of My Hot Leads customers so if you are serious about a lawsuit, we may be able to help you identify additional plaintiffs that are responsible for the faxes.
They are now being sued in federal court for their faxes and I believe that a permanent 50 state injunction will be requested by the Plaintiffs. Here is the lawsuit filed March 7, 2007: MyHotLeadsFederalLawsuit.pdf. If you are working on this case, John Brown (not Todd Whitman whose name is also on the case) would be glad to help you. If you aren't pursuing a case against them, please don't contact him.
History proves that the ONLY way to shut them down is you have to convince the Texas Attorney General to bring an action in federal court to enforce the existing injunction so that they stop. This is how fax.com was finally shut down in California. Nothing else worked. The reason an injunction works is that the Horne's can be put in jail for a few years if they violate a federal injunction. You can get 6 months in jail without a jury trial on contempt. They give a shit about that. Everything else is a joke. You can refer them to this page. The Texas AG already has an injunction against them. They need to bring an Order to Show Cause why the Horne's shouldn't be held in contempt. When you call, you can refer to this page: 8-22-2001 Cornyn Announces Court Judgment Against Broadcast Fax Business which talks about the injunction issued by U.S. District Judge Sam Sparks (Western District, TX).
However, they are only in contempt if they send their faxes into Texas or Minnesota. If you receive one of their faxes and you are in either of these states, contact us using the link on the left.
Unfortunately for us, they avoid these two states. Nice loophole. The judge in Texas didn't grant the AG's request that the Horne's be prohibited from sending faxes outside of Texas because there was no evidence that the Horne's were sending faxes outside of Texas. So that's what they do now, send faxes to the other 48 states. It will be several lifetimes before they get injunctions against them from all states so they just go along violating the law in the other states.
If you want to be removed from their list: Call Dave Crandall at 1-800-317-8309 or Fax him at 800-627-3723. Include the fax numbers you want to be removed (since they already have your number, it's not like giving them something that they don't already know!). If you've tried that and it doesn't work, contact us using the contact link on the left.
Mike and Greg Horne and their associates from American Blast Fax are still at it. Despite losing millions in court (judgments they never pay), and despite numerous injunctions (that they all ignore), they just change the name of their company and do the same fax broadcasting over and over and over again. I personally get their faxes and I get more complaints about them than any other company on the entire website. That's pretty impressive.
IMPORTANT: If you live in Minnesota and are getting faxes with any of the phone numbers listed below, please contact us using the contact link.
MY HOT LEADS (answers as "Hot Leads")
16901 Dallas Parkway
Addison, TX 75001
1-800-317-8309 (now disconnected)
1-972-248-3051 (now disconnected)
1-972-679-9379 (direct number to Mike Horne)
email domain: myhotleads.net (no website)
The Dallas Parkway address is their real address, but the people who answer the phone are instructed to tell everyone that they are located at 6009 West Parker Road Suite 149, Plano, Texas 75093 . The Plano address is a maildrop and is used to avoid being served with lawsuits.
One report says they are also known as CMG Marketing.
Businesses they send faxes for include mortgages, t shirts, and more. Whatever it takes to make money.
Here's the scoop on who the Horne's are because their names are really confusing. It's basically a father-son team with the daughter occasionally participating
- Mike Horne aka Robert Horne aka Michael Horne aka Robert M. Horne aka R. Michael Horne. Real name: Robert Michael Horne. He's the dad. He's 58. His son, Greg, who is 36, works with him in the faxing business. Lara Horne Albrecht, age 30, who is mentioned in the injunctions, is Mike's daughter. Mike has just one son, and one daughter. He lives on Thistledown Dr in Plano, TX.
- Greg Horne aka M. Greg Horne aka Michael G. Horne aka Greg Michael Horne aka M.G. Horne aka Michael Horne. Real name: Michael Gregory Horne is Mike Horne's son. See previous pgf. Greg is married. He lives on King William Drive in Plano, TX.
- Lara Horne Albrecht is Mike's daughter (and thus Greg's sister). See previous pgf. She's the President of Sunbelt Communications and Marketing, LLC which is one of their (many) companies. Albrecht is her married name (she is married to Walter Albrecht).
Lawsuit against them filed by Henry A. Turner:
Response numbers used on their faxes:
Fax back numbers:
Remove numbers believed to be associated with My Hot Leads
Reported by readers (not verified):
FYI, I've been getting lots of crap from My Hot Leads lately. The source number that sends it is 720-221-9509, sometimes 973-575-5301. The number to fax replies to is either 877-301-7629 or 877-301-7630. The remove/delete number is 877-877-0643 or 877-877-0718.
Company names used:
- My Hot Leads
- The Hot Lead LLC
- The Hot Lead Company
- The Hot Lead Company LLC
- SCM LLC
- Sunbelt Communications & Marketing
- Sunbelt Marketing
- SUNBELT ADVERTISING, LLC
- SUNBELT COMMUNICATIONS AND MARKETING, LLC
In addition, they use the following names so that the carriers don't figure out who they are and shut them down:
- RMG Communications
- Dallas Doorhanger
- AMC Company
- DGF Partners
- Hog Holdings
- AMC Group
- AJ Media
- SW Leads
- Desert Doorhanger
- Sky Holdings
- Pinnacle Financial
- Key Enterprises
- EMC Group
- Unique Business Solutions
- SML Financial
- SML Marketing
- Janis Holdings
- Adio Group
- S8 Consulting
- Windsor Marketing
- Broad Street Investments
- Big Red Services
- Avalanche Properties
- Minuteman Financial
- Chicago Development
- Cruse Company
- SLC Marketing
- ...and HUNDREDS of others!!!
People involved with MY HOT LEADS
- Larry Krouse aka Lawrence Krouse, sales, x103
- David Vaughan, sales, x104
- Scott Nickason aka Scott Nichason, sales, x139
- Dave Crandall aka David Crandall, sales, x108 (has worked with Krouse since at least apr 2004)
- Greg Horne
- Mike Horne
- Brooke Dean (an alias used to hide the identity of the receptionist)
- Mitch Martinez
- Bob Michaels
- Steve Faulkner (this is an alias Greg Horne uses to hide his identity and confuse people)
- Ben (an alias Greg uses to hide his identity)
- Bob Michaels (this is an alias Mike Horne uses to hide his identity)
- Don Magee, technician (sends out the faxes)
- David Best, technician (sends out the faxes)
- Steve Faulkner (not a real person; an alias that Greg Horne uses)
Relevant injunctions against faxing:
- State of Texas v. American Blast Fax, Inc., 164 F. Supp.2d 892, 897 (W.D. Tex. 2001). Injunction issued 08/17/01 by the US District Court, Western District of Texas, Austin Division. Case 1:00-cv-00085-SS State of Texas v. American Blastfax, et al Sam Sparks, presiding Date filed: 02/07/2000 Date terminated: 08/17/2001 Date of last filing: 12/21/2006. James L. Anthony and C. Brad Schuelke represented the State of Texas. Case number is also referred to as A00CA085SS. Here is the American Blast Fax Decision and the American Blast Fax Injunction.
- SunbeltInjunction.pdf (see SunBeltInjunction2.pdf for the original order) obtained by Minnesota AG's office in 0:02-cv-00770-JNE-JGL prohibits them from violating the TCPA anywhere in the country. Judge Joan Ericksen (formerly known as Judge Joan Lancaster) gave an excellent ruling that followed the law. She was appointed to the bench about a month before hearing the case, but she did an excellent job and has a clear and accurate understanding of the law.
Letter I wrote to Judge Lancaster:
- Letter to Judge Lancaster regarding Mike and Greg Horne. The judge can put them in jail for 6 months (without a jury trial) for contempt of her order. That's about the only way these guys are going to stop faxing.
Response I received from the Minnesota AG's office:
- MyHotLeadsAGletter.pdf: Letter from Minnesota AG. If they send faxes into Minnesota, they will enforce the injunction. There is also a copy of the injunction that they obtained.
The Hornes basically set up all sorts of companies to hide from people who go after them. And in depositions they can't seem to remember much. And they make it really hard to serve them (they have lots of experience evading process servers). So My Hot Leads is just a marketing company. That company then utilizes a faxing company. That faxing company leases equipment from an equipment leasing company. But Horne controls all the companies. It's just a shell game.
- DA-06-981A1 lists Greg Horne as the President
- http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2002/EB-02-TC-114.html FCC citation of Sunbelt Marketing
Most recent FCC citation shows addresses at:
16901 Dallas Parkway
Addison, TX 75001
(this is their real address; it is on the North Dallas Tollway south of Trinity Mills)
1400 Preston Road #300
Plano, Texas 75903
Here's the Nevada registration for the company:
Larry Krouse (see below) works there, along with Mike and Greg Horne. Krouse says he is just a sales rep who works there and Krouse told me (May 2006) that he reports to Steve Faulkner. Steve Faulkner is an AKA used by Greg Horne (but Larry conveniently "forgot" to mention that to me when we spoke).
Since late March 2006 up to and including when this was written (May 3, 2006), people have complained about war dialing by "The Hot Lead Company" which shows a callerID number of 818-638-8049 (see The Shit List THE HOT LEAD CO (818-638-8049). That thread traces the name of the company to this page Welcome to the Official Colorado No-Call List which shows that the "The Hot Lead Company" is located at essentially the same address as MY HOT LEADS above, i.e.:
The Hot Lead Company LLC,
6009 West Parker Rd.
Plano, TX 75093
One person on the blog wrote me and said: people have been getting calls from fax machines at ungodly hours, and then if they happen to have a fax machine hooked up to their line (as I unfortunately do, for business purposes), they receive a blank fax. From what I can tell, it looks like they will now start sending me junk faxes, after this blank one. I called their Texas number, posted by one of the bloggers, and asked to be removed from their list, but I doubt it will help. Many of these folks who got called say their numbers are unlisted and on the do-not-call lists!
Interestingly, there is also a:
Hot Lead Company
401 N BRAND BLVD
GLENDALE, CA 91203-4427
which is probably not related. There is no answer when you dial that number.
Here's a lawsuit filed against Krouse for junk faxing:
In that lawsuit, they served him (January 2006) at his residence address:
LARRY DEAN KROUSE
1104 WINDHAVEN CIR
LEWISVILLE, TX 75067-5438
This is the "re-incarnation" of ABF. See:
- American Blast Fax aka Cammas Group LTD
The following people who work at My Hot Leads also worked at Amercian Blast Fax (ABF):
- Larry Krouse aka Larry Dean Krouse, lead salesman
- Mike Horne aka Michael G Horne aka Michael Gregory Horne
- Greg Horne (former President of American Blast Fax, Inc.)
Krouse is 54. Krouse uses two different social security numbers:
- 466-xx-xxxx (his real one)
- 462-xx-xxxx (this is the social security number of his wife Dana which Larry sometimes uses, I'm sure by mistake)
May 9, 2006
I'm going through my email at 4:30pm. I notice an efax I got at 8:40am. It is yet another mortgage offer. The fax says to fill out the form and fax back to 1-800-801-3577. To delete, you are supposed to call 1-800-801-3126.
I do a local Google search on my hard disk and find that earlier this very morning, dw had posted a message on the junkfax list:
- Mr Horne has set up shop above Pomeroy's Shoes in Mesa Arizona Operating as SCM LLC a NV Corp . "He has set up a bunch of computers up on the 2nd floor and is sending out faxes" according to information obtained. [ But this is just one of his locations. They have faxing locations all over the country. For example, they have 48 lines from Bellsouth in Atlanta.]
- SCM LLC
- 136 W Main St #216
- Mesa Arizona 85201-7341
- (this is just a faxing location)
They gave their number as 877 301 7644. Greg Horne, Sunbelt Fax or The Hot Lead company. Plano, TX.
RespOrgs include Bestline and Teledata Solutions.
Also FDN Communications (Florida) who identified Atlanta numbers 404-389-0209 Response, 404-389-0194 Removal as subscribed to by Greg Horne. Henry Turner has details.
One might speculate that SCM stands for Sunbelt Communications & Marketing but they are actually "different" companies (same people, just two different names). The Nevada secretary of state website shows that the President Laura Horne (Greg's wife). The VP is listed at Greg Hornf.
Old addresses for Horne include:
- Sunbelt Marketing
- 2010 E Hennepin Avenue
- Minneapolis, Minnesota 55413
- Sunbelt Marketing
- P.O. Box 1162
- Durant, Oklahoma 74702
- They were listed in Nevada as SUNBELT ADVERTISING, LLC but that's revoked; See also in Nevada, SUNBELT COMMUNICATIONS AND MARKETING, LLC or THE LOGO & SHIRT COMPANY, or NETEFFX, INC.
Those are the two numbers on my fax! And Greg Horne is indeed involved in My Hot Leads so he likely has violated the injunctions.
Other interesting links:
- BOFH Junk Fax Page
My Hot Leads Customers
I discovered a posting on Jan 17, 2006 at 2:05pm
- I feigned interest in a "1% mortgages!" fax and got a call back from Danny Kitchell 760-431-7700 DRE # 01306378 offering to broker a refi for me. When I returned his call yesterday at 2pm, I asked him if "the payment options on the original fax are representative" of the payments available from the various lenders or if they are actual. He responded that "they are typical of negative amortization schedules..."
In fact, a DRE search shows that Danny is the agent.
So I did a google search to find the name of the company:
which lists two numbers: 888-452-4989 and 760-431-7700 and an address of:
Pacific Investment Properties
6120 Paseo Del Norte, Suite A-2
Carlsbad, CA 92009
Toll Free: 888.452.4989
The owner is listed on the website as Peter L. Edelmuth, President, Broker and Founder of Pacific Investment Properties.
At around 5pm, I called the 760-431-7700 number from my office. I said I was calling for Danny. The person asked why I was calling and I said I was calling about the lead company they were using. The person then told me that they used 3 different companies to generate leads and weren't really happy with any of them due to the quality of the leads. The person identified himself as Peter Edelmuth and even spelled his last name for me. I explained no, I wanted to get off the fax list and so Peter said Danny is the person to contact and told me to contact Danny at 760-607-0440.
I called that number and was connected with a receptionist who answered the phone "Pacific First Mortgage." I asked for Danny and put right through to him. I told him I wanted to know who he used to generate leads. He then started giving me the third degree as to how I got his name, etc. I told him someone had responded to the fax and was called by him. He asked who that was. I said that that person was using an assumed name and I didn't know what name he used. I told Danny I just wanted the name of the lead broker who was sending me the faxes. Danny said if I gave him my fax number, he'd have me taken off the list. I told him I wanted to know the lead broker so I could sue them. He again offered to take my number. I gave him my toll free number so he could have the lead broker call me. I asked him if it was Mike or Greg Horne. He hadn't heard of those names. I asked him about My Hot Leads and he said he had heard of them. I asked him who his contact was at My Hot Leads. He refused to give it to me. He said he'd give my number to the lead broker to call me. I called him again at 5:50pm. Danny said that he had heard I had talked to his partner, Peter. I asked if his contact was Larry Krouse. He didn't confirm or deny and told me he was a very busy guy and that he'd have the lead broker call me and was there anything else I wanted.
Last report is that Pacifc First Mortgage has stopped their illegal fax advertising due to all the complaints.
There is a website Website for dankitchellhomeloans.com which lists another number for Kitchell at (760) 583-2555. There is also a listing for him at Century 21 Beach & Inland -CSB 760-434-4521.
May 25, 2006 1:44pm
Dave Crandall calls my cell phone from their office (1-972-248-3051). He tells me he's calling for a client of theirs. He finally admits he's with MY HOT LEADS. He wants my fax number so I can be removed from their list. I tell him I want them to stop illegal faxing period. I tell him about the 2 injunctions against the Hornes. He refuses to admit who he knows and/or works with.